John Ward September 25, 2012 Why not apply the Aussie immigration model here in the UK?

At the End of the Day

I love both my daughters equally and unreservedly. The younger of the two is currently trying to get a permanent residency visa in Australia.

She in turn loves Australia, and wants to immigrate. She’s good at what she does, and just got another glowing management assessment at the company employing her out there. But being sensible people, those in charge in Australia don’t leave anything to chance.

Great Britain has an inestimable amount to learn from Australia. There – I’ve said it. Never thought I would, but I have. Here’s why.

The crap you have to go through to get a permanent residency visa in Oz would put off only those with a steely determination to become Australian. Myself, having spent some time there observing the degree to which the scenery and seas are lovely (but you’ll be bitten in the former and eaten in the latter) I think I’d rather immigrate to Iran. But you have to hand it to the Aussies, they only want the folks of good and tolerant character in the next generation.

You have to prove that the police forces of several continents love you. You have to prove the reality of every last educational qualification down to the Gold Star you got for a portrait of your pet mouse in kindergarten. You have to prove that without you, your employer would slide into inexorable insolvency. And you have to prove that you never bad-debted or bad-mouthed a single Australian in your life, and can recite the routines of Dame Edna Everidge by heart.

The rules of entry are so strict and complex, there is an entire legal sector out there – the equivalent size of conveyancing in the UK – that does nothing except help people apply for a residency visa.

Compare and contrast that frustrating but entirely rational filtering policy with what pertains here in Britain, where (it is estimated) there are around 15,000 dangerous Islamist plotters, and we do not know the whereabouts of any of them. In the UK today, so long as you turn up and hint that your great aunt’s dog Abdul has been subjected to government harrassment in your country of origin, the chances are that you’ll be let in. I know that sounds a bit Daily Mail and so forth, but the figures tend to support my somewhat cavalier generalisation: despite grandiose promises to the contrary during the 2010 General Election campaign here, figures released by the ONS show that immigration rose under the Conservative Party in the year up to June 2011, during which time 593,000 people gained permanent entry into the UK…an increase of 11,000 on the previous year. The year following that one has seen an influx only marginally lower.

As for the mechanism that exists for every arrival in Australia trying to convert a temporary visa into permanent residency, nothing equivalent to that exists in any meaningful sense in the United Kingdom. Dingbat analyses claiming that skills we don’t have here will be lost by stopping immigration are greeted with raucous hilarity down under: their view mirrors mine exactly – as in, “So train your own pool of unemployed”.

I’m sad that I don’t see my younger daughter very often, and I’m worried about the Oz economy catching pneumonia. But I’m delighted she’s making her own way in a world where the opportunities are gravitating towards where she is. Above all, I’m especially pleased that – just like her sister – she spots pc drivel a mile off, and ignores it. I cannot describe adequately the immense satisfaction – and pride – this produces in me.

38Comments

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1

Old Teacher on September 27, 2012 at 1:48 am

No it is not. They can get a working visa if they are under a certain age, then they have to prove that they are needed by an employer.
Also, try the “warm welcome” afforded Australians at 5.30 am when they land at Heathrow after about a 26 hour flight and are confronted by an arrogant and rude immigration employee who quizzes them for 20 minutes regarding a conference they have come to attend.
Came back last year on a Qantas flight with lots of young Aussies returning from the UK having been there on working visas. When the captain announced that we had landed in Sydney they let out an almighty cheer and the whole cabin clapped.

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Walrus on September 26, 2012 at 11:04 pm

The problem ladies and gentlemen, is that every man and his dog wants to emigrate to Australia and we don’t have the jobs and financial resources to accomodate all of them. We are also required by the rest of the world to be politically correct, in that black countries get very upset with us if we don’t let their citizens in as well as white people.

Our response is therefore to apply layers of strictly enforced red tape to the immigration process in the hope of avoiding a seven page article in The Times on Australian racism.

We have just revised the rules on processing illegal immigrants who arrive by boat in the hope of stopping them trying to get here from Indonesia and drowning in the process, as at least Three hundred have done in the last Two years.

Having said that, we could do with some more English speaking immigrants.

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3

Paul Tredgett on September 26, 2012 at 2:22 pm

I too have too beautiful intelligent daughters I am immensely proud of. Born in Oz because I went on the hippy trail in the 70’s and found myself here when no visa was required for Oz, I was a permanent resident the first day I landed, and coming via NZ, Oz immigration didn’t even have a record of my arrival.
How things have changed. 15 years ago, I went through the excruciating experience of bringing my mother here from the UK. Took 2 years hard labour to defeat immigration. Somewhere in the Oz immigration department is a mission statement that aspires to ‘maximum obfuscation’, ‘trenchant obstruction’, and ‘delay until the sun turns to a red giant’. The professionalism with which they go about this task is astonishing.
My most recent skirmish with Oz immigration a few months ago, was to assist a lady from Indonesia to come here. I found they have honed their bureaucratic skills to a nicety. I had three solid days of paperwork , a seventy page questionnaire/declaration, half a dozen supporting documents about things I haven’t told my mother, all to be signed and certified by a JP, and a life history I am thinking of turning into an autobiography. My Indonesian friend had to supply vastly more documents in English legalese, fly to Bali because this is all too difficult from a remote island, and supply a hefty fee of A$350. If granted, a visa would be only valid for seven days, so a flight has to be booked in the hope of getting a visa and facing loss if not granted. I cannot believe immigration duly considered the merits of the application in the detail we supplied. I think they just weighed it. Yep, 3.5 kgs of paperwork, OK.
All that was just for a TOURIST VISA.
So John. If your point was that Oz immigration is a ferociously lethargic guard dog…….well yes.

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4

max on September 26, 2012 at 2:05 pm

except most of them seem to have family connections in some EU country if not in UK !!! hence why it is easier . qed

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max on September 26, 2012 at 2:03 pm

it’s a good point. How many drunken uneducated poles are we going to have here eventually. The NHS will crack under the pressure of polish liver transplants. Don’t get me wrong, they are no worse than our uneducated. But we should be getting rid of some of them too!!! :)

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Lupulco on September 26, 2012 at 1:56 pm

@ Mike Harland
As for the benefit scrounging argument, when my daughter came back to Britain she ‘happened’ to have a Spanish passport. Despite having a British birth certificate, plus a social security card having worked in this country and paid taxes, and umpteen other UK identity documents, the DWP according to rules as of 2008 do not recognise any identity document other than a UK passport, so she spent six months as an ‘alien’ with no benefits, living off her savings and us.

If the above is true? Why do we, or the papers say, that Incomers from the EU and other places can get loads of benefits.

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7

Mo on September 26, 2012 at 1:25 pm

“I may be on the deportation list……”
That rather depends on whether common sense triumphs in the end, or whether the PC loony bin politics does. Who could say?
However, Joanna Lumley & Cliff Richards were both born in India, yet nobody suggests they are Indian. Also, the Duke of Wellington once said, when taken to task for being in the British army when he was born in Ireland,that “A dog can be born in a stable, but he is nonetheless a dog”.
Perhaps you should take comfort from that?

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Mike Harland on September 26, 2012 at 11:51 am

OK, there are too many people on these islands I agree, but there’s lot of contradiction in all of this ‘nationalit’y rubbish.

I have an elder daughter who just ‘happened’ to be born in Spain and therefore has dual nationality. She was brought up in the UK, resident for 20 years, educated here and got a degree here. She then went to Spain, worked and had a child there. It therefore ‘happens’ that my granddaughter is no longer British under current rules (1 foreign birth = 50% Brit = just in; 2 foreign births = 25% Brit = OUT).

As for the benefit scrounging argument, when my daughter came back to Britain she ‘happened’ to have a Spanish passport. Despite having a British birth certificate, plus a social security card having worked in this country and paid taxes, and umpteen other UK identity documents, the DWP according to rules as of 2008 do not recognise any identity document other than a UK passport, so she spent six months as an ‘alien’ with no benefits, living off her savings and us. Things only changed when she applied for a UK passport. She still of course had to prove she intended to stay in this country and was not just having a ‘benefits’ rest! She is now a qualified teacher and paying taxes to her reluctant overlords.

Conclusions:
Xenophobia rules, therefore be warned: have nothing to do with any foreigners if you think you are British. And definitely don’t leave the country thinking that when you come back you will still have any rights, no matter how much tax you’ve paid.

I wonder if, when the UK eventually leaves the EU, the fact that my granddaughter is not ‘British’ means she will then be forced to leave, or whether my naturalised Spanish wife might be next. I also wonder if the fact that my own mother ‘happened’ to be born in what was then Ceylon, means I may be on the deportation list too one day in these ‘clean-easy’ islands.

PS: some scientists claim from DNA research that umpteen thousand years ago most of these islands were inhabited by people of Iberian origin. So who do you natives think you are now then … ?

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9

Mo on September 26, 2012 at 11:41 am

Very funny! When my sons were on hol in Oz, they went into a restaurant in Cairns, which they described as a fishing port, & asked for the prawns that were on the menu. All the rather disinterested owner (watching footie on tv ), could suggest, (without turning round), was that he could send someone down to the local freezer shop to buy some prawns! Needless to say my sons were not impressed; In fact you could say that goes for the whole of their trip.

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10

True_Belle (@True_Belle) on September 26, 2012 at 11:22 am

oldasiahand
Useful but useless info- If I have read you right

Sadly I am over 28!

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11

ADB on September 26, 2012 at 10:32 am

Australia’s immigration policy might be tough, but the refugee policy is the usual disaster. Sydney-siders were shocked recently to see Muslims waving placards saying “Behead those who insult Islam” in response to the anti-Mohammed film. The protesters were the offspring of Lebanese immigrants foolishly admitted in the 1980’s. (The Cronulla riot, incidentally, was the result of people getting sick of Lebanese assaulting people, spitting at people’s shoes and saying things like “I wanna f**k your sister” while the police did nothing for fear of raising community tensions. Sound familiar?). In around 2005, Sudanese and Somali refugees were let in. I shocked my friend at the the time by saying, “You wait – in ten years’ time African gangs will be a real problem”. Fast-forward, and they are committing five times the street crime of locals, including stabbings and beatings for the hell of it. I just got the timing wrong.

Oz’s immigration policy might be tighter than the UK (although this doesn’t explain how the Sub-continental population is growing so much, with all the usual undesireable side-effects), but Australian society is steadily being eroded by the importation of Third Worlders, just like the rest of the West.

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12

Jon on September 26, 2012 at 10:17 am

You’ll still have to explain the logic of your third para. Because it’s a non-sequitor as it stands.
And everal hundred thousand immigrants? What, like the Greeks in the 60s and 70s? Oz seems to have absorbed them.

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13

Robin Banks on September 26, 2012 at 9:37 am

This Stewart Lee routine on emigrants certainly makes me laugh. Reminds me of why I couldn’t stick living in New Zealand. Like having your brain ripped out and having it flung into a swamp.

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14

oldasiahand on September 26, 2012 at 9:30 am

An oldie but goodie!

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15

oldasiahand on September 26, 2012 at 9:29 am

No it isn’t unless there are family connections. We can get working holiday visas to go there and vice versa if you are under 28.

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16

Gemma on September 26, 2012 at 9:26 am

Hys

could you elucidate on your brief comment, please? Whilst it might not compute, it is hard to judge quite what does not compute when a response is as vague as yours.

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Gemma on September 26, 2012 at 9:23 am

Jon

an interesting remark, and one I expected – rather than any intelligent response to the main point of my argument.

Australia is a small country. A population of 20 million is not big, by any estimation. Britain’s economy (and especially the building industry) was decimated by the sudden influx of Poles in the mid 2000s. Can you imagine what several hundred thousand immigrants would do to the Australian economy?

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18

QuarkHunter on September 26, 2012 at 9:11 am

It is perverse that Australian immigration so zealously screens potential migrants with origins and home language most likely to facilitate seamless integration here. Over the last few years thousands of people from the greater Middle East travelling through Indonesia to Australia have been waved through to permanent residence with even providing proof of identity (having destroyed all documentation on departure from Indonesia per the modus operandi of the agents arranging transit by boat).

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19

Hysteria on September 26, 2012 at 9:11 am

and for Pat Condell’s view see here

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20

Hysteria on September 26, 2012 at 9:09 am

Waaa? something does not compute in this summary !

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Lupulco on September 26, 2012 at 8:45 am

Imigration from a different veiwpoint, especially the last 30 secs or so.

Just one thought, when i was in the Merchant Navy in the 70’s it was no great problem getting into countries, but moving currency, now that was a drag. Come to the 90’s movent of money, No Problem, but people, thats a drag.

Keep up the good work John.

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22

zeusgoose on September 26, 2012 at 8:18 am

So this guy was hoping to immigrate to Australia. Upon arriving in Australia, he was questioned by a customs officer, “What is your business in Australia?

“I wish to immigrate,” he replied

The customs officer then asked, “Do you have a criminal record?”

Confused, he replied, “I didn’t think you still needed one.”

Boom boom…..I`ll get me coat!

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23

Jon on September 26, 2012 at 7:47 am

You’ll have to explain the logic of that third para.

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True_Belle (@True_Belle) on September 26, 2012 at 7:39 am

JW

It is easier for Aussies to come over here to work than it is for Brits seeking work over there.

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25

Gemma on September 26, 2012 at 7:31 am

There is another issue here, which puts Britain at a real disadvantage in the EU. It is often overlooked by the British since they are largely unaware of the regulations in place in other countries.

Under EU law, it is required for a person to live in a country for five years before any social benefits can be claimed. That means the claimant needs to prove five years’ residence – or put the other way, more importantly, the country in question can refuse to offer social benefits if the person claiming has not been resident in the country for five years.

This means that Britain must provide social benefits immediately any EU immigrant arrives.

Whilst partly off-topic, it does show that the EU have restrictions in place. They are not as tight as Australia’s, but Australia is a “small” place with a population roughly the same as the Netherlands!

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26

Lynn Atkinson on September 26, 2012 at 7:24 am

Two of my cousins have immigrated from South Africa to the USA and Canada respectively. One a kidney surgeon and the other an audiologist (hearing disabilities). Both have had to rewrite their exams completely before they could practise in either of those countries, before they could even contemplate applying for permanent residency! The exams were in English. No choice of language or interpreter.

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Col on September 26, 2012 at 7:22 am

The system over here is very tough in my experience and i am amazed with the media portrail that it is so easy. I think our big problem is actually being in Europe and so free movement is a given. It is this immigration which is easy.

Getting in from out of the EU is totally different. Been married 7 yrs now to a ukranian and the stuff we had to do was a lot to get the necessary visas. It cost about £1500 to get all the correct visas and then passport. It wasnt hard, but it was paper work – bank statments, engligh translation of her qualificcations (notaried by a solicitor), police reports (again needed translation).

We have friends here working where my wife works (big uni) and they are from belarus. Very bright and she has done a degree at the uni and now has her first job. she is on £16k, but needs to be on £20k, but next winter in order to stay. Loosing this bright person is a waste and it is these people we need to keep. You would never know she was foreign by the way. Speaks fluent, unaccented english, plus fluent french and some italian (and russina of course).

In this current crack down it is the bright young people we are pushing away from the UK, but we are still going to pull in x number of uneducated Poles. Plus how many assylum seekers ? Just thought i would shed light on the other side of the coin.

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Old Teacher on September 26, 2012 at 6:21 am

Hi JW
Hope she gets PR and settles in happily. Often find it quite ironic that Australia began by the British getting rid of who they didn’t want, and the population was bolstered in the 1950s and 60s by the ‘ten-pound Poms’. Our family? Couldn’t get out of Ireland quick enough in the 1840s and never looked back.
Despite what the Liberal (conservative) party nay sayers whine, the economy is fine strengthened by mining and escaping the GFC largely through quite strict government control of banks.
Maybe it is the biting, eating things here that keep us all on our toes so that we dont all become complacent?
Have spent bits of time in the UK and couldn’t get over the bone eating cold, the bleakness and the way that everyone went to work in the dark and came home after dark , although loved the museums, the theatre and the history.
Welcome Junior Slogger!

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29

Eleni on September 26, 2012 at 6:09 am

At the same time, the No.2 from our UK office 12 years ago – an educated white American professional with no ‘mystery’ past (and whose family were 18th century dutch emigrants to America) was refused permission to stay.

No explanation, apparently random – maybe there were too many Americans applying that year?

He now lives and works in France.

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30

El.tel on September 26, 2012 at 6:03 am

Great place Australia, no regrets moving here,three healthy intelligent children thanks to the system here, god knows how they would have turned out in inner city uk

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31

ultra909 on September 26, 2012 at 5:48 am

Meanwhile, it appears those naughty Swiss are kicking the leg from the €-table with their CHF-peg:

http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2012-09-25/snb-pickle

Oh, and also trading in Iranian oil, according to the first comment.

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ultra909 on September 26, 2012 at 5:29 am

Specifically, you might want to review the section where they talk about a “covenant” that existed between the Islamists and the British govt/security establishment whereby UK provided sanctuary on the unwritten understanding that it did not then become a target of operations itself.

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ultra909 on September 26, 2012 at 5:22 am

On the subject of militant Islamists in Britain, I watched this rather measured independent docu recently on the circumstances and figures surrounding the events of July 7, 2005.

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Yana on September 26, 2012 at 5:09 am

Lived in Sydney Australia for 6 years , amazing country , really great people .On the top of all that you say about their immigration regulations add the very high cost of the applications and medical clearance ranging from $5.000-20.000 .They want you to take them seriously .Good for them.

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NightHawksAtTheDiner on September 26, 2012 at 3:06 am

Bill…. No boatloads of money does not make any differance, missing four years working somewhere else.

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Bill Casso on September 26, 2012 at 2:50 am

Night Hawks…….If you bring a boat load of money into Canada aren’t you exempt?

Do you want to discuss the missing four years?

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NightHawksAtTheDiner on September 26, 2012 at 2:39 am

It is very similar in Canada. I am 59, work for a major oil company and I have to get police clearance for everywhere I have lived since I was 18 that is 15 countries. The irony is I have been in Canada (paid taxes in full) 8 of the last twelve years.

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Bill Casso on September 26, 2012 at 12:18 am

I was talking to the boat lift operator at the local marina the other day and I asked him where he was from. He said ” Bulgaria” I asked him what brought him to the U.S. he said some friends had tried for several years to get into the states via the lottery. They urged him to apply, he said that he didn’t think he wanted to immigrate. They said you probably won’t win and if you do, you don’t need to go, so he applied and won. It seems the U.S. needs some random Bulgarians to help us out. Who knew?

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